db 149 suffering/being free disaster/reasoning ~~~
Those arguments would strongly support the claim that the Gospels, or at least this Gospel, are working in something very close to a midrashic mode for the generation of their narrative, especially for the present purposes in anything having to do with the Son of Man.
Once again,
we see here evidence
that the idea of a suffering Messiah
would not have been at all foreign to Jewish sensibilities,
which derived their very messianic hopes & expectations from such methods
of close reading of scripture, just as Yeshu did: this identification between the Son of Man
and the fate of Jesus comes to its culmination in the verses from chapter 14 several times before
in which Yesh is asked about (t)his messianic identity by the high priests just before the crucifixion & confesses openly
(for the first time?) that he is a (the?) Son of G d, THE MESSIAH/meshiach, the Son of Man who will come 'on the clouds of heaven'; Yeshayahu/Isaiah's "suffering ser-vant" as meshiach in Jewish Traditions?!
The suffering MASHIACH who atones for our sins was a familiar idea throughout the history of the Jewish religion, even long after there truly was a separation form Christianity. The idea of a suffering Messiah is present in ancient, medieval, & early modern Judaism!
This fact, at the very least, calls into question the truism that the formation and acceptance of this idea by followers of Jesus constituted the necessary & absolute breaking point with the religion of Israel. The Suffering Messiah is part & parcel of Jewish tradition from antiquity to modernity. Not only, then, is the Gospel drawing on Jewish tradition bit this idea remained a Jewish one long after Christianity had indeed separated off in late antiquity.
One of many important pieces of evidence for this view is this history of how Jewish commentators have interpreted
Isaiah 53:
WHO HAS BELIEVED WHAT WE HAVE HEARD? And to whom has the arm of the Lord been revealed?
For he grew up before him like a young plant, and like a root out of dry ground; he had no form or majesty that we should look at him, nothing in his appearance that we should desire him.
He was despised and rejected by others; a man of suffering and acquainted with infirmity; and as one from whom others hide their faces he was despised,many we held him of no account.
So surely he has borne our infirmities and carried our diseases; yet we accounted him stricken, struck down by God, and afflicted.
But he was wounded for our transgressions, crushed for our iniquities; upon him was the punishment that made us whole, and by his bruises we are healed.
All we like sheep have gone astray; we have all turned to our own way, and the Lord has laid on him the iniquity of us all!
He was oppressed, and he was afflicted, yet he did not open his mouth; like a lamb that is led to the slaughter, and like a sheep that before its shearers is silent, so he did not open his mouth. By a perversion of justice he was taken away. Who could have imagined his future?
For he was cut off from the land of the living, stricken for the transgression of my people! They made his grave with the wicked and his tomb with the rich, although he had done no violence, & there was no deceit in his mouth. Yet it was the will of the lord to crush him with pain: when you make his life an offering for sin, he shall see his offspring, & shall prolong his days;
through him the will of the Lord shall prosper
...
Out of his anguish he shall see light; he shall find satisfaction through his knowledge. The righteous one, my servant,
shall make many righteous and he shall bear their iniquities. Therefore I will allot him a portion with the great,
and he shall divide the spoil with the strong; because he poured out himself to death,
and was numbered with the transgressors;
yet he bore the sin of many,
and made intercession
for the transgressors.
Once again,
we see here evidence
that the idea of a suffering Messiah
would not have been at all foreign to Jewish sensibilities,
which derived their very messianic hopes & expectations from such methods
of close reading of scripture, just as Yeshu did: this identification between the Son of Man
and the fate of Jesus comes to its culmination in the verses from chapter 14 several times before
in which Yesh is asked about (t)his messianic identity by the high priests just before the crucifixion & confesses openly
(for the first time?) that he is a (the?) Son of G d, THE MESSIAH/meshiach, the Son of Man who will come 'on the clouds of heaven'; Yeshayahu/Isaiah's "suffering ser-vant" as meshiach in Jewish Traditions?!
The suffering MASHIACH who atones for our sins was a familiar idea throughout the history of the Jewish religion, even long after there truly was a separation form Christianity. The idea of a suffering Messiah is present in ancient, medieval, & early modern Judaism!
This fact, at the very least, calls into question the truism that the formation and acceptance of this idea by followers of Jesus constituted the necessary & absolute breaking point with the religion of Israel. The Suffering Messiah is part & parcel of Jewish tradition from antiquity to modernity. Not only, then, is the Gospel drawing on Jewish tradition bit this idea remained a Jewish one long after Christianity had indeed separated off in late antiquity.
One of many important pieces of evidence for this view is this history of how Jewish commentators have interpreted
Isaiah 53:
WHO HAS BELIEVED WHAT WE HAVE HEARD? And to whom has the arm of the Lord been revealed?
For he grew up before him like a young plant, and like a root out of dry ground; he had no form or majesty that we should look at him, nothing in his appearance that we should desire him.
He was despised and rejected by others; a man of suffering and acquainted with infirmity; and as one from whom others hide their faces he was despised,many we held him of no account.
So surely he has borne our infirmities and carried our diseases; yet we accounted him stricken, struck down by God, and afflicted.
But he was wounded for our transgressions, crushed for our iniquities; upon him was the punishment that made us whole, and by his bruises we are healed.
All we like sheep have gone astray; we have all turned to our own way, and the Lord has laid on him the iniquity of us all!
He was oppressed, and he was afflicted, yet he did not open his mouth; like a lamb that is led to the slaughter, and like a sheep that before its shearers is silent, so he did not open his mouth. By a perversion of justice he was taken away. Who could have imagined his future?
For he was cut off from the land of the living, stricken for the transgression of my people! They made his grave with the wicked and his tomb with the rich, although he had done no violence, & there was no deceit in his mouth. Yet it was the will of the lord to crush him with pain: when you make his life an offering for sin, he shall see his offspring, & shall prolong his days;
through him the will of the Lord shall prosper
...
Out of his anguish he shall see light; he shall find satisfaction through his knowledge. The righteous one, my servant,
shall make many righteous and he shall bear their iniquities. Therefore I will allot him a portion with the great,
and he shall divide the spoil with the strong; because he poured out himself to death,
and was numbered with the transgressors;
yet he bore the sin of many,
and made intercession
for the transgressors.
03 mrt 2013 - bewerkt op 04 mrt 2013
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